Townsville

Forwarded from Arthur Robinson

 

Peter,

 

I am sending this to you only as i keep getting messages some of the adresses on your list are rejected.

 

See attached diagram.

Geoff is partially correct. See comments below.

Arthur R

----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter Bruce" <pbruce1@optusnet.com.au>
Sent: Friday, June 17, 2011 1:22 PM
Subject: Fw: Townsville

> Thanks to Geoff for this clarification.
>
> Peter Bruce.
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Geoff Kirton"
>> T'ville must have had the most complicated rail layout in Aust.
>> Had the workshops, loco depot, railmotor depot & station north of Ross Creek.

 

This is correct.

Passenger trains from the south travelling on to Cairns would diverge to the right at South Townsville enter the staion from the north.

They would then depart for Cairns direct.

 

Passenger train from or to the GNR would use the southern connection.

 

The train hauled by 1302 would have been heading south to Stuart and then most likely west to Mount Isa, probably with passenger acommodation thus leaving from the station area.

 

>> South of Ross Ck. was Townsville South Yard which had a diamond crossing of the main line to access the wharves, nickel loading facilities & sugar
>> terminal.
>> Also a yard which was roughly oriented north-south in the appropriately named suburb of Railway Estate.
>>
>> Have a feeling that South Yd may have been replaced by a park & a motor racing street circuit, after looking at a photo in a Qld travel supplement from a "Herald Sun" recently.

 

No! the South Yard is still there and is the main yard for the Townsville area.

 

There is a long term plan to provide a new line to the port and move the freight facilites to the Stuart area.

Long is the definitive work in this case.

>> Also that a new station was built on a bypass in the southern or western suburbs somewhere, like Mackay.
>> Looking at this travel supplement, I could see the former station in the distance.

 

The New station is just on the south side of Ross Creek, see attached diagram.

All tracks north of the blue line on the diagram have been or are to be removed.

>> Think there was a requirement that it had to be kept for heritage
>> purposes, especially for the original GNR building. Yes, but without a rail connection.
>> Townsville still has the carriage workshops.
>> I think the original T'ville 'shops were that saw-toothed building in the
>> background.
>>
>> The ancient looking railmotor was a Panhard, I think - the other bigger
>> ones probably AEC's.
>> One of those RM's was in your photo at Bowen, with the 2 trailers - & the
>> bonus water & hills backdrop.
>> Have a feeling that Bowen has been by-passed as well with a new station
>> once again to the south or west. Yes.
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Geoff

Monday Morning Photo. Tuesday 14/06/2011.

G'day All, only just got around to scanning these photos taken at Townsville. The area around the loco depot and the railmotor depot was probably the most ramshackle major rail installation I've ever seen.

I've realised that there has been a substantial re-organisation of the railway at Townsville, the original station has been abandoned by the looks of things on Google maps so it is a bit hard to imagine what the layout was back in '64.

My guess is that GE diesel 1302 is heading west with those early freight containers behind the loco but perhaps someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

I think that the Great Northern Railway railmotor was somewhere near the old station, it seemed not to have turned a wheel for quite some time. Every railmotor I saw in Queensland during this trip seemed to be different. Can anyone enlighten us about this elderly luxury chariot? It looks like the Northern Division's breakdown crane is in the background of the earlier pic of 1302.

We were in Townsville on a Sunday so the joint wasn't really jumpin', I think 1302's train was the only movement we saw between the departure of the northbound "Sunlander" and whatever slow roadside goods it was that we left town on...... later that night I think it was, it would have been our sleeping accomodation anyway.

I'm going to have to do some serious recollecting about the trip north to Cairns, I know we took in a sugar mill or two and I know that at either Ingham or Innisfail we were bailed up by a zealous guard who demanded that we pay for the privilege of riding his particular length of the old QGR, most unreasonable! We couldn't really complain though, we probably only paid for 150-200 miles of the 1043 from Brisbane to Cairns and probably less on the return. I'm using the 1962 Timetables so I'll leave it to the readers to do the metric conversion. According to this timetable it would have cost us 253 shillings for a return 2nd class fare Brisbane-Cairns, $25.30. No wonder we tried to avoid paying!!

Cliff Olds, I've really enjoyed the account and photos of your Nullabor saga.

Regards to all,

Peter Bruce.

All postings can be found at http://teenagerailfan.blogger.com

Monday Morning Photo. 23/05/2011.

G'day all, I've been away a bit over the last few weeks as well as being fairly busy so havn't had the time to spend on MMP. In the meantime I've had some very informative emails from Queenslanders Arthur Robinson and Brian Webber as well as from Geoff Kirton here in Melbourne and I have posted them at my blog http://teenagerailfan.blogspot.com I'll pick up the journey at Bowen, I'm guessing [definitely not remembering] that we travelled the 115 miles and 38 chains north from Mackay on a very slow goods behind Pacific 1028 seen here with fellow traveller Graeme Westwood always and still only known as Westy.

Some time later RM94 arrived, according to the Working Timetable for the Northern Division issued on 22 July 1962 this left Townsville at 7.55am and stopped almost everywhere before getting to Bowen at 2.10pm on this particular Saturday arvo.

About all I can remember about Bowen is catching the northbound "Sunlander" to reach Townsville, there was nothing else running so we actually had to contribute to the QGR's financial health by buying tickets.

We got to Townsville not long after sun-up and stepping out of the airconditioned cars was like stepping into a sauna and the sun was bouncing off that big rock that dominates the city.

I'll take a break from 1964 Queensland for my next effort and post a few pictures taken on my recent visit to South Australia.

Regards,

Peter Bruce.

Fw: More on Mackay

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Geoff Kirton" <geoff.kirton@rmit.edu.au>
Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2011 4:25 PM
To: <pbruce1@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: More on Mackay

> Hello Peter,
>
> Having got the pronounciation debate out-of-the-way yesterday and sent the
> email - suddenly remembered why you would be having problems with Mackay
> Railway Stat.and Google Earth.
>
> Reason is that the railway was deviated from Paget to the south to the
> west of Mackay some time in the early to mid. 1990's.
> Fortunately our RMIT University Library has a Qld. country street
> directory.
> Sure enough the former railway and yards near the CBD and from the south &
> west have been removed, with a new station for Mackay constructed at
> Paget, 4 km south of the original station.
> Paget was the junction for the North Coast Line & the branch west to Finch
> Hatton, and a couple of other places originally, including Victoria.
>
> Reasons were to upgrade the NCL to 21 ton axle load, concrete sleepers,
> CTC and replacement of wooden bridges, so that marvellous 180 degree curve
> to enter Mackay from the east has gone.
> The steel girder bridge over the Pioneer River west of Mackay was needing
> to be upgraded or replaced, I seem to remember, so another station out of
> the city centre and another deviation was constructed.
> Added benefits of course were removing level Xings and freeing up valuable
> real estate ha! ha!
> Unsure whether the original station has been kept - this where Google Maps
> & Google Earth are required!
>
> Still does not conclusively solve the location of your 3rd & 4th photos,
> but still inclined to suggest Prosperine with its sugar mill, the next
> major town heading north up the NCL.
>
> Cheers
>
>
> Geoff Kirton
>

Fw: Mack-a or Mack-i

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Geoff Kirton" <geoff.kirton@rmit.edu.au>
Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2011 4:11 PM
To: <pbruce1@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Mack-a or Mack-i

> Hello Peter,
>
> Thanks for the photos.
>
> Unsure myself as to the location of your 3rd & 4th phots, as the last time
> I visited Mackay Railway Station was in June 1984.
> My first guess is Proserpine, given that you travelled from Bowen to
> Townsville mostly in the dark (i.e. the small hours)
> The further north and west we are from Rocky and Toowoomba, the greater my
> unfamiliarity with rail stations and yards.
> A Queensland equivalent of Weston Langford's plans of track layouts is
> desperately needed, unless such info. already exists.
> Would be a fascinating document, given the "interesting layout" of some
> Qld. rail facilities.
> My first guess is Proserpine, given that you travelled from Bowen to
> Townsville mostly in the dark (i.e. the small hours).
>
> As to the pronunciation - when I first went to school in Toowoomba, I had
> a teacher who was born in Mackay, and he said "kay" as in "bay".
> Later on though, another teacher who had taught there used "kay" as in
> "eye".
> Both seemed to be used, but nowadays, people in radio & TV tend to use
> "kay" as in "eye".
> Perhaps "kay" was a local or regional decision from long ago.
> My feeling is that between 1971 and 1986, I rarely heard "eye" was mostly
> used.
>
> Enough of the grammar and railway lessons!
>
> Cheers
>
> Geoff

Fw: Monday Morning Photo. 25/04/2011.

 

From: Dad

Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2011 8:24 AM

To: Peter Bruce

Subject: Re: Monday Morning Photo. 25/04/2011.

Peter,

 

I am fairly certain that the photos of  B18 1/4 No. 27 at the north end of the yard and and BB 1073 and PB15 105 are at Mackay, the sugar boxes are the confirmation.

 

The other two photos are at Bundaberg, 569 is has just come off the bridge over the Burnett River and is crossing Burbong Street.

 

1617 is on the same road crossing which is at the end of Bundaberg station.

 

I have forwarded the photos to Arthur Hayes and Brian Webber, both spent some time in Mackay in the days of steam, Arthur a a fireman and Brian as a railway enthuasist and photographer.

 

The locomotive 105 is a C16 not a PB15. The C16s when rebuilt with the "Master Mechanics Front End" were the only QR locos with the distinctive tapered funnel.

 

The numbers are interesting as QR reallocated locomotive numbers. For example of B18 1/4 No. 27 was built in 1935 after C16 No.105.

 

Back when I was a young lad I thought that PB15 No. 5 was QR's the fifth loco, it was all very confusing especially as there was a C17 No. 2.

 

Incidentally when I joined QR in 1981 my service number was lower than others with longer service, another QR venture into the world of recycling.

 

QR also recycled bridge girders, so far I have found 65 instances, some for rail bridges and others for road overbridges.

 

Others were sold to The Main Roads Department and sugar mills for reuse.

 

Arthur Robinson

 

Fw: Monday Morning Photo. 25/04/2011.

 

From: Brian Webber

Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2011 9:31 AM

To: Dad ; Hayes, Arthur ; pbruce1@optusnet.com.au

Cc: Hallam, Greg ; Farlow, Caitlin ; Campbell, Dennis ; Elsol, John ; David Langley ; Bruce McLean ; jgof@datafast.net.au ; Graeme Cleak ; Bob Wilson ; Weston Langford ; John Phillips ; John Thompson ; liamdavies@optusnet.com.au ; milantram1859@yahoo.com

Subject: Re: Monday Morning Photo. 25/04/2011.

Gents

 

My credentials are that I worked for a Bank in Bundaberg in 1962/63 and in Mackay in 1963/65, 1969 and 1979-81.  How lucky can one be!!

 

1617 is leaving the [South] Bundaberg station on the main line [platform road] and running north probably to North Bundaberg loco to stable. 

 

105 is a C16 and is working a harbour shunt.  It will take its train of sugar box MTWs through the Goods Yard and across one of the 3 Pioneer River bridges [at that time] to Mackay Harbour.  Note a down train in the platform road and the Netherdale Rail Motor [a 102hp unit and two trailers] in the east Up dock.

 

569 is arriving [South] Bundaberg off the Burnett River bridge with a goods, probably from Wallaville or Tirroan although it is possible it is leaving the Millaquin branch [the junction is below the train and the line ran east [to the right of the photo]. 

 

When I first visited Mackay, the locals told me it was pronounced Mac K as that was how the person the town was named after pronounced it but when I last worked in Mackay in 1981 it had evolved to Muck eye.

 

Thank you for the memories.  Bundaberg is little changed but the area of Mackay Passenger station is gone replaced by the by-pass and the current station at what was previously Paget.

 

Brian Webber